18 Comments

1. Ike says:

   February 26, 2009 at 8:00 pm

   Love that corrugated concrete!

   It’s like prison, but with more bald white men
2. probuff says:

   February 26, 2009 at 8:47 pm

   come on. this is a good effing plan. who in the world asked tim tielman what he thinks? he acts like he speaks for everyone. he doesn’t speak for me.

   god forbid we build something where commerce actually takes place. commerce took place in the original canal area and commerce is what BUILT the area. commerce draws people in and entices them to come back again and again and again- exactly what we need.

   i love buffalo but only in buffalo do we let a handful of sixtysomething hippies get in the way of projects. these people are not public officials and only represent themselves, yet act like they “i’d like to see…” no one cares what you’d like to see!

   these people are as bad as the unions
3. Matt says:

   February 26, 2009 at 9:27 pm

   so many times in buffalo’s history, decisions have been made without thinking of the repercussions down the road. tim tielman’s discussions on the good, bad, and ugly architecture/urban planning around the city from TrueBlueBuffalo have shown that he has a lot to bring to the table. this project should go forward, but do it right- we really only get one chance.
4. Andrew Kulyk says:

   February 26, 2009 at 10:35 pm

   I was there last night… as was the WNYMedia posse… Brian Z, Geek and All Things Buff.

   Now that I’ve had a night to think about it, I’m really kind of bummed about the whole thing. I look again at that codified 2004 plan, which really dealt only with the “Central Wharf” parcel under the skyway, and now look at the 2008 schematics, showing roughly the same street grid, and similar buildings mimicking the structures of the historic era, and I fail to see significant differences in the two concepts. Yeah, no permanent structures under the skyway, instead an open market, but putting buildings under the bridge really that doesn’t make sense.

   Problem is, the pulse of the audience last night wants to stick to Ye Olde Buffalo Town with a strict historical interpretation of the 1800s and not a scintilla of divergence to the plan to accommodate everything else. I truly admire their passion, but with that energy I hope that common sense and compromise will rule the day so that we can finally get this moving.

   Truth be told, entertainment, retail, “big box”, commerce and recreation can coexist with history and heritage to create and sustain an exciting critical mass.

   Many of the ideas and comments put forth last night were EXCELLENT. Hope that the powers that be at ECHDC will be listening.

   Lastly, having been privy to the earlier agency scoping session for the involved public agencies, I can now say unequivocally that the ECHDC is NOT the heavy here when it comes to delays and schedule setbacks. They’ve got their act together and are ready to move things along and they understand the sense of urgency. Unfortunately, some other public entities, who I won’t call out individually here, don’t seem to share that sense of energy and purpose.

   Phase 1 debut… Memorial Day, 2011. C’mon EVERYONE!!!! Let’s find the middle ground, put a bulls eye on that date and GET IT DONE!!!
5. Jon Splett says:

   February 26, 2009 at 11:10 pm

   We’re in a recession and someone wants to build something that will create some jobs.

   Shut up and build it already.

   This really shouldn’t be that hard.
6. STEEL says:

   February 27, 2009 at 12:46 am

   THis video was extremely infuriating. The real problem is that these people are not in control of the process. It is more ego that anything from what I see.

   Back a year ago or so when Base Pro was planned to be directly on the water edge inside the “Approved Public Consensus Historic Plan Area” They were all saying they had nothing against Bas Pro if it was moved off to the Aud site. NOW they are saying Bas Pro should not be here at all. NOW they are expanding the area that they demand to be Part of ye old fake canal towne to the Aud site and to across Main. It is absolutely ridiculous.

   Earth to Ye olde Canal Towne people. Everything was demolished! There is nothing left. And by the way not too many people around the country know anything about the Erie Canal and are not interested in coming to see a fake version of it.
7. David Allen says:

   February 27, 2009 at 12:53 am

   If they want a strict historical interpretation, I can’t wait to come home on leave and visit the brothels, and watch all the businesses throw their trash into the water.
8. Mike In WNY says:

   February 27, 2009 at 1:16 am

   At least a real brothel creates real wealth and jobs, unlike typical government spending.
9. Christopher Smith says:

   February 27, 2009 at 10:39 am

   I’ve long been in the “get something built” camp on the Bass Pro issue, but we do need a backup plan in the event that market conditions change for Bass Pro. If they choose not to build here, what is the anchor tenant of the development? They have still not signed a binding agreement.

   I’m also not opposed to incorporating some design ideas from the preservation community to add some historical markers to the area. The three tiered canal, cheesy signage, non-navigable waterways outside Bass Pro and waterfall are a bit much.

   The buildout in the ECHDC diorama is nothing more than wishful thinking. There is a collapsing retail market in America with a coming depression. Building this out based on the market assumptions of 2005 (that retail can power a tourist destination) might be off the mark in 2011.
10. Mike In WNY says:

    February 27, 2009 at 1:49 pm

    Since a real commitment from Bass Pro seems to be akin to chasing rainbows, why not just throw a for sale sign on the site and let the bidding begin?
11. Denizen says:

    February 27, 2009 at 2:56 pm

    I’m with the Brothel crowd on this one. If Bass Pro bails, I’d suspect Ass Pro would be wickedly successful in its place.
12. Denizen says:

    February 27, 2009 at 2:58 pm

    Oh and and everything Chris Smith said too. Our economy is basically in the shitter and in obviously no condition to experiment with high-risk, faux-historic tourist traps.
13. Pauldub says:

    February 27, 2009 at 3:33 pm

    Johnny Morris is a businessman. If the ECHDC had looked like they had their act even half way together, he would have signed long ago. They are proving the point with the weird stuff they are putting out now. I’m with Denizen. Bring in Ass pro.
14. Prodigal-Son says:

    February 27, 2009 at 7:08 pm

    To borrow a line, Tim Tielman never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity, does he?
15. Prodigal-Son says:

    February 27, 2009 at 7:21 pm

    I just watched the video again, and got angrier the second time.

    Two honest questions:

    1) Has Tim Tielman et al ever made their own proposal about what they’d like to see in the space, and what they consider “appropriate” development. In this case, as nearly every other, it appears they only complain, without constructive new ideas, and let someone else do the creative heavy lifting.

    2) Does the ECHDC have to listen to them? Please say no.
16. PJ says:

    February 27, 2009 at 11:38 pm

    What is the deal with Tim Tielman and the not for profit that he directs. Does it have any other employees? Does it merely exist so that Tielman has a way of getting paid for opposing everything? If that is the case doesn’t he need to oppose projects in order to generate donations to fund the not for profit?
17. Christopher Smith says:

    February 28, 2009 at 12:23 am

    @15 Yes, Tielman invested 15 years of time in leading the development of the approved 2004 master plan for the inner harbor. You can criticize Tielman for a lot of things, but he has been proactive and involved in the project for a long time.
18. WNYwatercooler says:

    March 2, 2009 at 10:24 pm

    lol depression.. real GDP will not decline 10% + there is no depression and there won’t be one.. Bass Pro all along said they would not sign a binding agreement until the Aud site was 100% cleared, which will happen in June. why does everyone always have to be so negative?